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misterlowercase
12-13-2016, 12:34
Recently stumbled into an auction of old Erinmore tins from a wide date range and it was interesting to denote the evolution of the warning label.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/16-Vintage-old-empty-Tobacco-Tins-Murrays-Erinmore-Flake-pipe-/302165084403?hash=item465a7148f3:g:UsIAAOSw4shX9YX D


http://i.imgur.com/mQNNqQa.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/aT79QOT.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/c6oUlrn.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/32ik55E.jpg

I couldn't find an example of the most recent artwork because it's against the law to display a tobacco item...

https://www.cigarhut.com.au/erinmore-flake-50g/

...and apparently no Oz Erinmore pipesmokers have put up a pic on the nets.

If the new tins are under the same restrictions as the ciggy packs, then it'd be 85% warning label with the rest being olive drab and the brand variant being a plain uniform standardized font.

Most likely looking like this tin of Log Cabin seen in this highly interesting short article:
http://www.alanahunt.net/work/east-kimberley/scratched-tobacco-tins/

That's the scratch,
out.

Overwrote.

On 29 April 2010, in what was heralded as a new benchmark in global leadership for tobacco control, the Australian Government announced that it would be developing legislation to introduce mandatory plain packaging of tobacco products in 2012.

The Australian Government's announcement about its intention to introduce plain packaging received overwhelming support from the health sector, with spokespeople describing the announcement as 'the most important national development in tobacco control since tobacco advertising was banned in the '90s and commenting that it was 'difficult to exaggerate the importance' of such reforms.

Pack design doesn't just communicate the 'personality' of a cigarette brand to the smoker... it also allows smokers to project these characteristics to others when they handle and display the package throughout their daily routines.

Just as designer clothing, accessories and cars serve as social cues to style, status, values and character, so too can cigarette packs signify a range of attributes about users. As 'badge products', cigarettes can reinforce the characteristics conjured by brand image.

This behaviour not only affects the single consumer but also exerts a powerful effect on their friends, associates and even casual contacts. Consumer theory and research has demonstrated that incidental consumer brand encounters (ICBEs) powerfully affect buying patterns in ways in which the consumer is not fully aware.

A series of four studies published in the Journal for Consumer Research in 2008 for instance found that repeated exposure to simulated ICBEs:
"...increases choice of the focal brand among people not aware of the brand exposure, that perceptual fluency underlies these effects and these effects are moderated by perceivers automatic responses to the type of user observed with the brand."

Unregulated package colouring and imagery contributes to consumer misperceptions that 'light and mild' brands are safer.The colour of the pack is also associated with perceptions of risk and brand appeal. Researchers concluded that removing colours from packs (plain packaging), as well as terms such as 'smooth' 'gold' and 'silver' would significantly reduce false beliefs and increase compliance with existing legislation.

blah blah blah
http://www.tobaccoinaustralia.org.au/11-10-tobacco-display-as-advertising1

:guide:

misterlowercase
12-13-2016, 12:34
Inevitably,
just like the scratch-out or sharpie marker,
there comes easy solutions from the private sector:

http://www.billleak.com.au/uploads/2/4/5/5/24558836/slips-ons-slip-ons.jpg?730

http://www.billleak.com.au/slip-ons.html

http://www.packwebasia.com/images/stories/productspacks/box_wrap_stickers_b.jpg
http://www.proprint.com.au/News/328190,label-printer-turns-plain-cigarette-packaging-into-sticker-success.aspx


This video has a great theme song!
:music:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eo8niihV3fE

Shaunc
12-13-2016, 22:38
Our new erinmore flake comes in a pouch, and yes, like all tobacco and cigarettes they're in a plain green package with the government health warnings and a small non descript lettering showing the brand and type.
Eg. Erinmore flake pipe tobacco or macbarens plum cake pipe tobacco etc.

misterlowercase
12-14-2016, 04:43
Our new erinmore flake comes in a pouch, and yes, like all tobacco and cigarettes they're in a plain green package with the government health warnings and a small non descript lettering showing the brand and type.
Eg. Erinmore flake pipe tobacco or macbarens plum cake pipe tobacco etc.

Shaun,
many thanks for replying -- it's a shame about the packaging I think.

I notice that you've been around here quite a while, if you have any old posts discussing the Australian regs, I'd love to have a link to them, as it's maddeningly of interest because it seems that that's how the winds are blowing everywhere else nowadays.

I'm coming at it from an alienated viewpoint and perspective as I have no clue in regards to how Australia really is in reality.
Is the public in general accepting of the extreme measures? In agreement with the notion that baccy is an evil element which needs be heavily regulated against?

Is there currently a populist uprising against the absurdities of the intellectual left?
Or has generational conditioning set the mentality toward compliance for the greater good?

Has post-colonial theory made a major impact in that the history itself instills a sort of blanket guilt?

I don't really know what I'm asking,
and I'm asking it awkwardly too,
apologies for my dense head.

I'm from the south and we're often caricatured as lazy barefoot hillbillies, but oddly it's something I take pride in and I've never been offended by the characterization, in many ways it's accurate despite the animated overamplification,
it is myself and my family and the people I know...

...difficult to explain really,
but what I was getting at was cultural identity and what has become of it?
Are we all to be unified into a homogeneous stewpot of sameness?
It seems that there are some powerful elements at work who desire such an outcome,
and in large part, they are winning the philosophical war.

Sometimes I just wish everything was easy to figure out, portrayed in easy-to-grasp terms that either get you or don't.
Like Barry Mckenzie or something, although a cartoonish character similar to Croc Dundee, he kinda endears himself and represents a sort of underlying consciousness integral to a specific place, embodying a casserole of many different aspects, frontier individualism and digger spirit for example, and defiantly clinging to a hardwon heritage.

Have the pommy bastards won?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2V1OE-yIzA

I don't know what I'm talking about and went onna ramble...

Shaunc
12-14-2016, 08:14
In Australia a pack of 25 cigarettes cost $30, 50gm of rolling tobacco $50, 50gm pipe tobacco $60. Smoking is not a cheap hobby. At the moment our government has set up a tobacco strike force due to customs seizing 22.5 tonnes of illegal/smuggled tobacco/month. We only have a population of 22million so it's quite substantial.
Black market tobacco is fairly common here. It works in a similar way to drug dealing. You either have to know someone or be ok'd by someone who knows someone and you'll meet somewhere like a parking lot of a pub, you'll be given a smoke and if you like it you buy a carton (200 cigarettes). I blame the government for creating this black market through their own greed. The government claim that they've done it to stop people smoking and claim only 13% of Australians smoke but the figure is much higher in the blue collar industries. I work on a local council in the water and sewerage section more than half smoke, three quarters is probably closer to the mark.
Recently I got a tin of Dunhill royal yacht from a tobacconist I know, it was smuggled, I could tell by the tin not meeting government regulations but I got it for the right price and it smokes just as sweet as tobacco in the green tins so I'm not complaining.

misterlowercase
12-14-2016, 11:34
Thanks for the details Shaun.

That's a pretty grim picture.

Sadly such measures are underway in many countries now, and the ultimate endgoal of the control apparatus system, a state of affairs very close to outright prohibition despite all of the well-known ill side effects that come along with such strict policies.

I heard about chop-chop:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chop-chop_(tobacco)
Is that style of stuff only a small underground market, or is it popular?


...instead of quitting, many smokers are buying cut-price cigarettes from the dangerous and unregulated illicit industry, which distributes 2.4 million kilograms of tobacco across the country every year.

The Budget expects to raise $4.7 billion from tobacco addicts, but not a cent will be spent on anti-smoking campaigns, making some claim the tax hike is more punishment than practical solution.

Since smoking is known to be highly addictive, raising prices isn’t necessarily going to force people to quit. But since smokers are more likely to be socio-economically disadvantaged, many will look for cheaper ways to get their fix.

... a large rise in unbranded “chop chop” tobacco.

The industry is dominated by serious and organised crime groups, who see the illegal tobacco trade as a low-risk, high-profit opportunity, according to a 2015 report by the Australian Crime Commission. The ACC said it was “highly likely” the market will remain attractive to crime rings for these reasons.

It’s hard to advocate making money from a dangerous addiction, but small businesses say they are bearing the brunt of the pain from the tobacco tax hikes as customers turn to illegal traders and smugglers.

http://www.news.com.au/finance/economy/australian-economy/illegal-tobacco-industry-flourishing-in-australia-as-government-hikes-taxes/news-story/c1d28c0a1919d0fbcc499579a2386b28

Corndog
12-14-2016, 11:46
In Australia a pack of 25 cigarettes cost $30, 50gm of rolling tobacco $50, 50gm pipe tobacco $60. Smoking is not a cheap hobby.

Yowsa! That's rape man. We pay $3 to $6 for a pack of 20 cigarettes depending on the brand. But the cheap ones have just about everything but tobacco in them. A pouch of PA costs me less than $3. They say Missouri has some of the cheapest taxes on tobacco in the US. Not sure how true that is but a 60 cents a pack tax hike failed recently.

Curious to know Shaun. What does your government do if you get a gift package in the mail from out of the country? Do they open packages and then smack you with a huge fine if it happens to be a gift of tobacco?

misterlowercase
12-14-2016, 15:51
Another side effect of an article becoming taboo, that's a bit more on the positive side, is the rise in collector interest. I've noticed that Australia seems to have a good many tin collectors with a rather fierce market commanding quite high prices. Even nonsmokers may be drawn into the allure of a more happy past, and prohibition policies help to fuel the upswing in such nostalgia.

I'm not a collector of Australian tins, but I just had to get this book because it is so comprehensive and well-done, it's an incredible tome which is profusely illustrated with many images in full color. It is massive at almost 2 inches thick.

I wish that the same treatment could be given to the UK tobacco industry, but it'd be a mammoth task and would likely require multiple volumes to do it proper justice.

Perhaps if I had smoked Havelock Aromatic and fell in love with it, I might be just as passionate about that stuff like I am with the UK baccies because after tasting St. Bruno and Condor I went off the deep end into an obsessive mania!

Australia used to have a pretty large tobo industry.

Here are a few highlights from within the pages...

An interesting note about the title is that "smoko" is Australian slang for a smoke break:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smoko


http://i.imgur.com/8owJulR.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/zM7oXKK.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/ipBmkbc.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/ACnM55K.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/FDW9nr7.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/9c7ew4A.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/M1qNj2g.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/4xv81ZB.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/wwYvAyL.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/cZcw751.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/DwY7CnE.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/ouq3rd9.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/i7510fc.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/7wbSCVJ.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/dYO013H.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/mOlbeTC.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/hdUKPhN.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Ie5svIs.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/kHuiCwl.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/eo4nOyY.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/fVSpLm9.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/QyVj9Ut.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/4D65Fa3.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/9i50Nsj.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/WCnQrUv.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/XD1iNgX.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/FyonW4t.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/xhpXx2A.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/IdQdC6c.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/iYrCWI7.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/ewAm8T3.jpg

Shaunc
12-14-2016, 21:03
I don't know all of the above brands but I do know a few of them, havelock, gold bar, capstan and WD & HO Wills.
As far as the looney left goes there has been an uprising.
Most recently it regarded greyhound racing which the government wanted banned. Because of voter backlash the government backed down. Dog racing like smoking and drinking are working class pass times/hobbies in this country. That sport is not run in the same way as American greyhound racing. Many people keep a small number of racing dogs in their backyard.
Politically Australia is run on a 2 party system. The problem working class people like myself have is that the right wing party despise us and the left wing party couldn't organise a bonk in a brothel plus they're too concerned with appeasing the politically correct left wing academics. This has resulted in a lot of smaller parties and independent politicians winning seats in government. The next big thing in this country to see politically is the rise of right wing (nationalist socialist) parties in Australia. Unfortunately every time nationalist socialist is used people read that as nazi and it's not necessarily true.
As far as chop chop goes that hasn't been available here for quite some time as the tobacco farms have been closed by the government but again that was caused by the government themselves and the big tobacco buyers.
A farmer was getting from the big tobacco buyers $40/bale, the organised crime figures were paying $800/bale. Smokers were getting tobacco for about $80/kilo. At the time 50gm of store bought tobacco was $40. Everyone was winning except the government and big business. As far as getting gifts through the mail if the customs find it you will be issued with a tax invoice so it will only end up marginally cheaper than buying at a shop. Quite a few blokes try this tactic and refer to the tax invoices as ransom notes.
Also I might add that oral tobacco (snus, chew, dip) are completely illegal in Australia and can only be obtained illegally. We are also one of the highest taxed countries in the world. I work a 2nd part time job at the airport and am taxed at 48c in the dollar on that wage, petrol is close to $1.50/litres and a schooner of beer at the pub is $5.00.

misterlowercase
12-15-2016, 14:31
I don't know all of the above brands but I do know a few of them, havelock, gold bar, capstan and WD & HO Wills.
As far as the looney left goes there has been an uprising.
Most recently it regarded greyhound racing which the government wanted banned. Because of voter backlash the government backed down. Dog racing like smoking and drinking are working class pass times/hobbies in this country. That sport is not run in the same way as American greyhound racing. Many people keep a small number of racing dogs in their backyard.
Politically Australia is run on a 2 party system. The problem working class people like myself have is that the right wing party despise us and the left wing party couldn't organise a bonk in a brothel plus they're too concerned with appeasing the politically correct left wing academics. This has resulted in a lot of smaller parties and independent politicians winning seats in government. The next big thing in this country to see politically is the rise of right wing (nationalist socialist) parties in Australia. Unfortunately every time nationalist socialist is used people read that as nazi and it's not necessarily true.
As far as chop chop goes that hasn't been available here for quite some time as the tobacco farms have been closed by the government but again that was caused by the government themselves and the big tobacco buyers.
A farmer was getting from the big tobacco buyers $40/bale, the organised crime figures were paying $800/bale. Smokers were getting tobacco for about $80/kilo. At the time 50gm of store bought tobacco was $40. Everyone was winning except the government and big business. As far as getting gifts through the mail if the customs find it you will be issued with a tax invoice so it will only end up marginally cheaper than buying at a shop. Quite a few blokes try this tactic and refer to the tax invoices as ransom notes.
Also I might add that oral tobacco (snus, chew, dip) are completely illegal in Australia and can only be obtained illegally. We are also one of the highest taxed countries in the world. I work a 2nd part time job at the airport and am taxed at 48c in the dollar on that wage, petrol is close to $1.50/litres and a schooner of beer at the pub is $5.00.

Excellent post Shaun,
thanks for sharing.

Very interesting stuff.

misterlowercase
07-27-2017, 18:12
...just noticed a listing pop up for the Smoke-O book, a bit on the pricey side though...

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/232425998407?rmvSB=true

...it's a great book!